The subject and tone of this thread is perfectly acceptable at this forum. Nobody is forced to read, or participate in, this discussion. This thread will remain.Moonrider wrote:Danny, why did you bring that dead horse over here? Don't you get enough bloviating over this subject on other boards?
Wiseguy, kill the thread before this carcass starts stinking up this forum too!
No Sound Choice??
Danny you are wrong...ASCAP & BMI have nothing to do with what we put on our hard drives. They are not our protection from Sound Choice or anyone else.DanG2006 wrote:If you read at least the label of Sound Choice's discs they say use in public is prohibited. So where does that leave us? That's what the ascap and BMI fees are for.
The issue with public vs commercial is....we are not legal to play one song in a commercial setting, whether it be from a hard drive or disc. You, nor I, nor anyone else has verbal or written permission from Sound Choice or Chartbusters or anyone else to play the music for profit...IE commercial usage. You can play it in your house for yourself all night long with no worries. Step outside and do it for money and you have a problem.
It has nothing to do with ASCAP & BMI they only collect monies for the original music owners. Song writers and musicians. ASCAP & BMI don't share any money with SC or CB or Pioneer...
So technically if you play anybodies song to make money without their permisssion ...YOU ARE ILLEGAL.
ASCAP & BMI do not police format shifting. They could care less about Sound Choice or Chartbusters or us. As long as the bar owners pony up their performance rights fees the music used could be on toilet paper. Just playing someone elses music without paying to do so from a Jukebox, DJ, Bands, KJs, TV, Radio, or internet. If you do they want some money.
Bigdog, I have to say that you just contradicted yourself. In the first part you state that ASCAP and BMI have nothing to do with the rights for playing karaoke in public and then your last two sentences says exactly the opposite.Bigdog wrote:Danny you are wrong...ASCAP & BMI have nothing to do with what we put on our hard drives. They are not our protection from Sound Choice or anyone else.DanG2006 wrote:If you read at least the label of Sound Choice's discs they say use in public is prohibited. So where does that leave us? That's what the ascap and BMI fees are for.
The issue with public vs commercial is....we are not legal to play one song in a commercial setting, whether it be from a hard drive or disc. You, nor I, nor anyone else has verbal or written permission from Sound Choice or Chartbusters or anyone else to play the music for profit...IE commercial usage. You can play it in your house for yourself all night long with no worries. Step outside and do it for money and you have a problem.
It has nothing to do with ASCAP & BMI they only collect monies for the original music owners. Song writers and musicians. ASCAP & BMI don't share any money with SC or CB or Pioneer...
So technically if you play anybodies song to make money without their permisssion ...YOU ARE ILLEGAL.
ASCAP & BMI do not police format shifting. They could care less about Sound Choice or Chartbusters or us. As long as the bar owners pony up their performance rights fees the music used could be on toilet paper. Just playing someone elses music without paying to do so from a Jukebox, DJ, Bands, KJs, TV, Radio, or internet. If you do they want some money.
ASCAP & BMI cover the performance of the music. Coming down the pike (Mid July) Sound Choice is bringing out a license (authorization to use commercially) that provided you comply with it's terms will at least cover Sound Choice's GEM series sets of discs.
ASCAP & BMI don't care about us. They go after the bar owners. They could be doing any kind and type of music from any format. They just want performance rights fees. WE as KJs don't have to pay them. They may be only slightly interested because we work for the bar owner. But that's as far as it goes. Doesn't matter if I'm singing with a kazoo. It's only the music being played that they want to collect for, not the actual music player or the format used.
They (bars) are actually buying a license to play the music in their bar for profit. That's the fee.
We are not licensed to play karaoke music in public. Not one note. ASCAP & BMI can't give us that permission. That has to come from Sound Choice and technically the actual artists through the publishing companies. That's why Sound Choice has to pay for the rights to use the songs. They are buying permission for "X" amount of copies. They have not been given the permission for us to play in public. And they are not authorized to give us that permission. We buy the songs from Sound Choice for our own personal usage. Not public performance.
We are all totally illegal as far as public performance rights go. You own the disc and technically that doesn't give you the right to shift the format or play out. None of us pass go and none collect $200, we go directly to jail. Paying ASCAP or BMI can't get you out of jail because it's not their right to unlock the door.
It's a totally different permission slip.
They (bars) are actually buying a license to play the music in their bar for profit. That's the fee.
We are not licensed to play karaoke music in public. Not one note. ASCAP & BMI can't give us that permission. That has to come from Sound Choice and technically the actual artists through the publishing companies. That's why Sound Choice has to pay for the rights to use the songs. They are buying permission for "X" amount of copies. They have not been given the permission for us to play in public. And they are not authorized to give us that permission. We buy the songs from Sound Choice for our own personal usage. Not public performance.
We are all totally illegal as far as public performance rights go. You own the disc and technically that doesn't give you the right to shift the format or play out. None of us pass go and none collect $200, we go directly to jail. Paying ASCAP or BMI can't get you out of jail because it's not their right to unlock the door.
It's a totally different permission slip.
Now as far as me already paying for Sound Choice songs once and having to pay again to justify my format shift, I'm not happy about either.
I already have over $50,000 invested in my music. Not counting what it cost me to format shift it to protect my investment. That was several thousand more.
Sound Choice isn't going to do it cheap. Figure at least $1 per song. How many Sound Choice songs are there? Wiseguy enlighten us with an answer. How many KJs can afford to fork over thousands of dollars to stay in business? It's easier to stop playing Sound Choice songs. And cheaper.
Which will cost you more money? Paying Sound Choice thousands or going out of business or stop playing their songs? Only one option doesn't cost you a dime. The other 2 cost you lots.
Then you will have to pay Chartbusters thousands for their songs. It won't end.
All oldies karaoke sounds pretty cheap to me. Pioneer and DK and some others are dead and gone. We won't have to justify with them. I hope....
I already have over $50,000 invested in my music. Not counting what it cost me to format shift it to protect my investment. That was several thousand more.
Sound Choice isn't going to do it cheap. Figure at least $1 per song. How many Sound Choice songs are there? Wiseguy enlighten us with an answer. How many KJs can afford to fork over thousands of dollars to stay in business? It's easier to stop playing Sound Choice songs. And cheaper.
Which will cost you more money? Paying Sound Choice thousands or going out of business or stop playing their songs? Only one option doesn't cost you a dime. The other 2 cost you lots.
Then you will have to pay Chartbusters thousands for their songs. It won't end.
All oldies karaoke sounds pretty cheap to me. Pioneer and DK and some others are dead and gone. We won't have to justify with them. I hope....
No, you are misunderstanding. You go through an audit and are found 1:1 you get the permission to shift your songs to the computer.Bigdog wrote:Now as far as me already paying for Sound Choice songs once and having to pay again to justify my format shift, I'm not happy about either.
I already have over $50,000 invested in my music. Not counting what it cost me to format shift it to protect my investment. That was several thousand more.
Sound Choice isn't going to do it cheap. Figure at least $1 per song. How many Sound Choice songs are there? Wiseguy enlighten us with an answer. How many KJs can afford to fork over thousands of dollars to stay in business? It's easier to stop playing Sound Choice songs. And cheaper.
Which will cost you more money? Paying Sound Choice thousands or going out of business or stop playing their songs? Only one option doesn't cost you a dime. The other 2 cost you lots.
Then you will have to pay Chartbusters thousands for their songs. It won't end.
All oldies karaoke sounds pretty cheap to me. Pioneer and DK and some others are dead and gone. We won't have to justify with them. I hope....
Doesn't matter if it comes out tomorrow..it's still not legal.
All that will do is make them happy. It doesn't change the legalities of anything except with them.
The problem is they failed to keep up with technology and it passed them by.
While they were buzy trying to Media Cloque everything, the industry passed them by. They fell behind right after the first Ipod was sold.
Discs are caveman stuff as far as music is concerned. Mass storage devices are the king right now. They are playing catch up now, whether it's because of the copyright laws being out dated or technology moving too fast or something else. The computer world/technology is moving way too fast for everyone that can't keep up or isn't thinking about it enough. It passed the copyright law too.
You are trying to move/stay ahead with your electronic song books. I'm staying with paper books for now unless Cap & Trade makes using paper illegal or too expensive.
All that will do is make them happy. It doesn't change the legalities of anything except with them.
The problem is they failed to keep up with technology and it passed them by.
While they were buzy trying to Media Cloque everything, the industry passed them by. They fell behind right after the first Ipod was sold.
Discs are caveman stuff as far as music is concerned. Mass storage devices are the king right now. They are playing catch up now, whether it's because of the copyright laws being out dated or technology moving too fast or something else. The computer world/technology is moving way too fast for everyone that can't keep up or isn't thinking about it enough. It passed the copyright law too.
You are trying to move/stay ahead with your electronic song books. I'm staying with paper books for now unless Cap & Trade makes using paper illegal or too expensive.
